"Lee Woods should be allowed to remain on ATEV. Sure, he's been a little (or more than a little) rough at times, but he does have a legitimate gripe."

Lee might have a legitimate gripe but how many times does he have to let us know about it? This is an on going thing with him. I can't recall a time when he had anything positive to say. There are constructive and destructive comments. It appears Lee's are mostly destructive. There is a good and bad way to present your case and name calling doesn't qualify as a good one. It is like an item I was looking at on Ebay. The seller had 9 negatives. On checking, they were all from the same buyer. My question was, if the seller is so bad, why does this guy keep buying from him? Perhaps this should apply to Lee. If FR and Dennis are so bad, why keep buying the product? Lee's tirades become tiresome after one or two of them. Sure you can skip over them but when he takes up several postings that can be hard. Let Lee stay, it can get amusing and is good for the drinking game.

I think what become's tiresome is all of the people who want to stand behind Dennis and FR when even they know there are problem's. Yes Lee may repeat the samething but what about all of the same people who say over and over again how wonderful FR is. I never saw anyone step up and say how wonderful Gearbox was like they are doing for Dennis and FR

Mike...this board is fine the way it is (with many thanks going to you for trusting us to be human). We can handle any obnoxious person with our razor sharp wit and tongues and are big enough to DEAL (pun intended) with the odd tricky situation by simply ignoring it. If it gets worse than that, then I more than trust your good grace to do with them what you wish. I have been on this forum for a long time now(as have a few others) and from where I stand you have not let me down in any way shape or form and I thank you for that.
Lee ....you need to sort out this BS once and for good. One message to alert all here that there is an ongoing problem is appreciated by all, twice is reinforcing a point, but airing dirty laundry time and time again is bordering on obsessive/compulsive behavior.

PS Mike...you can boot Chuck off any time you like...just cause you can...he has a bad record with "the other forum" ROTFLMAO

I mean yeah come on you all are talking about TOY trucks...not like its a presidentail descision or something..

Yeah, I believe booting him would be a bad idea. I was chastised many times on this board for speaking out about Code 3 and quality issues, as well as the customer service debaucle, the 2nd Philly quint and the lack of public response for about 6 weeks from John, too much FDNY, repaints..etc etc. I was basically banned from the other board as well, because I dared to challenge those who only wanted to hear positive and not negative things, constructive or not. It was, either you support code 3 and john d, or shutup (read "don't like it don't buy it", or "quit talking about the quint issues" read - banned from board. Anyway, I certainly wouldn't ban someone because a coward refused to come forward and indicate who he is when he complained about him "poisoning" the board.

In the words of the appointed ones - If you don't like it - ignore it - don't read it - whatever you want.

And personally, I think First Response and Dennis have had more than their fair share of time to make things right with these products between delay after delay after delay and quality issues. Just as bad as Code 3 - the both of them doe nothing but blame everyone else but themselves. Newsflash - you can't blame everything in the world on China. Both code 3 and first response make very poor business decisions and then fail to take responsibility.

Location: Illinois

Joe... No offense meant, but I too have written complaint after complaint about J.D. and Code 3 having NO Quality Control, NO Customer Service, and totally ingoring it's customers and club members to the point of ad nauseum on "another board" and never was intimidated or otherwise excommunicated. So I find it, tho I am not saying it didn't happen, but I find it difficult to believe you were banned.

As for the Philly Debacle, I ranted on and on about the defects, the failure to respond to customer complaints, the cover up by saying it was the "packaging" that caused the damage (talk about BS when the parts vaporize from a sealed container). If anything, I was encouraged by the moderators to add photos of my model to enhance my complaint.

I have been very outspoken against J.D.s miserable failure with the C-3 Forum and expressed it there and on the "other" forum as well. These complaints have gone without reprisal from either board.

I for one have simply given up... I have not, am not, and will not buy another Code 3 product until I see some MAJOR CHANGES IN THE PRODUCT AND IN THE WAY THEY TREAT THEIR CUSTOMERS.

Once again, my point... DON'T BUY THE PRODUCT IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT. There are at least other sources with the police diecasts, less with the fire diecasts.

Gearbox had it's faults. I got my share with two left side turn signals on both the right and left side. I got my share with paint flaws, I got my share with broken/missing parts, and I got my share with flawed graphics... They were by no stretch of the imagination the Primo Replicas.

Gearbox was not into making anything beyond what they originally made. If it wasn't accurate.. So what.. Live with it!! It was only as they approached their end that they started to make additional lightbars. However, they would not yield to any requests for detailing beyond what they already had. If your car did not use a lightbar... they made sure that it did (for their replica).

So I guess it boils down to this. I for one do not have the money to start my own diecast factory. So, if I want to continue with this hobby, I have to deal with what I have available. I suggest it is time to MOVE ON.... I finally came to that conclusion for myself...

About every "Toymaker" out there has problems with their product. You can find problems with the cheapest to the most expensive. I know we all work hard, and expect the most for our money.

The people who express dissatisfaction with some companies are not only unhappy with the product, they are really turned off by "Spokesmodels" who are just BS'ers. If C3 and FR would just shut the F up, not constantly toot their own F'n horns, and fix the problems, maybe they wouldn't receive the flack. There is nothing more annoying than reading how wonderful their company is to collectors (from their STUPID spokesmodels) when the reality is that most of what they tell us is just crap.

Chuck - you hit the nail right on the head there. Motorcade - no offense taken. All I know is one day I tried to make a post on the other board, a day after posting several threads on the Squirt issues, and it gave me some kind of msg and wouldn't let me post any further.

Location: Illinois

"continued vulgar verbal assaults"

Sorry I mustn't have been paying attention

Location: Outside the USA